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07/26/2021 - Best Mortgage Rates from Big & Reputable Lenders and SD Reviews (30year @ 2.75%, 15year @ 2.25% etc)
July 4, 2020 at
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Deal Details
Last Edited by shahhere July 26, 2021 at 06:35 AM
Details on how to understand the Mortgage basics and information that I understand for your learning can be accessed on this post (Click this hyperlink to go to the post); If you are new to this process and have questions this is a Must Read before asking question on the forum!
Reviving my over a decade old thread from SD and FW as the rates have gotten competitive. This thread is a SD community thread to compare and post best rates received along with their lender experience for a quick compare and estimation from a starting point.
Please note that rates will vary on quite a few factors and just because one person has a rate will not guarantee you will receive the same rate but simply use this as a guide and negotiation tactic.
All below rates are based on assumptions of certain LTV, DTI, & Excellent Credit Scores:
30 Year Fixed best rates (Assuming Good Credit & 20% down, low LTV, low DTI, etc etc):
Shahhere
Old Thread - https://slickdeals.net/e/1223863-03-06-2009-best-mortgage-rates-from-big-reputable-lenders-30year-5-15year-5-arm-s-etc
Reviving my over a decade old thread from SD and FW as the rates have gotten competitive. This thread is a SD community thread to compare and post best rates received along with their lender experience for a quick compare and estimation from a starting point.
Please note that rates will vary on quite a few factors and just because one person has a rate will not guarantee you will receive the same rate but simply use this as a guide and negotiation tactic.
All below rates are based on assumptions of certain LTV, DTI, & Excellent Credit Scores:
30 Year Fixed best rates (Assuming Good Credit & 20% down, low LTV, low DTI, etc etc):
All listed lenders are here because I shopped them and have encountered competitive pricing and not because I get any sort of a kickback....use this as a gauge for the latest but note that things can change week to week, day to day and even hour to hour:
07/14/2021 2.875% Better.com- Will consider Lender Match to beat Competitors and combine with Amex cashback (Click here for additional Forum thread details). Amex's "Digital Assist" Team @ 800-297-7500
07/14/2021 2.875% LoanDepot.com - Is competitive but works better if you have another offer for them. My LO Luke Dean
[email protected] 949-652-4521
07/14/2021 BSMFunding (David Pressel) - Call to get the latest rates (no published online). Very competitive rates; get everything in writing via email!
https://bsmfunding.mymortgage-onl...essel.html
David Pressel (NMLS: 562175)- Branch Manager - Phone: 908-208-2036
[email protected]
07/14/2021 2.5% LoanCabin [loancabin.com] - Most Competitive but refinance times have grow to almost 6 months for many people so proceed with caution as recent reviews indicate normal 1 month closing. Generally do not charge for big Lender Fees (A+B on LE) as they are under $100 in most cases; esp if appraisal is waived for your scenario.30 Year Fixed Jumbo Best Rates (Assuming Good Credit & 20% down):
07/14/2021 3% LenderFi - Competitive but might be slow and not work on beating other lender rates.
TBD15 year Fixed:
07/14/2021 2.0 % Better.com; matches Bankrate rates for themselves.Title Company Comparisions:
07/04/2020 2.5% NIH Credit Union with Lender Credit
RadianTitleDirect.com - OP has used them for almost a decade with getting best rates (closed after Covid, Lender must submit order as consumer side is closed).Alphabetical list of other lenders (some could be non-proven without direct member experiences posted here):
ALTTitle.com
https://www.valerotitle.com/ - Texas only.
- AimLoan - Will provide LE without hard pull if credit is frozen https://www.aimloan.com/
- Amerisave - will give you scores from all 3 bureaus with just a soft pull https://www.amerisave.com/
- Better.com https://better.com/
- BoxHomeLoans https://www.boxhomeloan
s.com/ - Close Your Own Loan https://www.closeyourow
nloan.com/...sults.aspx - Colonial Mort http://www.colonialmor
t.com/ - HighTechLending http://www.hightechlen
ding.co/Default.aspx - Interactive Mortgage https://interactivemort
gage.com/ Eric from IM is super rude so good luck dealing with this guy! - LenderFi https://www.lenderfi.com [lenderfi.com]if the link wont work try this backend link: https://app.lenderfi.com/app/sign...r/lenderfi
- Loan Cabin https://www.loancabin.c
om/ - Loan Depot https://www.loandepot.c
om/ - LoanLock https://www.loanlock.co
m/ - NavyFederal CU https://www.navyfederal
.org/ - NIH credit union (Delware, District of Columbia, Maryland, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Virginia, West Virginia) https://www.nihfcu.org/
- Northpointe Bank https://www.northpointe
.com/ - Owning.com (Operates only in CA) https://owning.com/
- Pentagon Federal CU https://www.penfed.org/
- Provident Funding - will give LE without locking rate https://www.provident.c
om/ - RatePlus (California) https://www.rateplus.co
m/ - Travis Credit Union (12 North Cal Counties only) https://www.traviscu.or
g/ Eligibility traviscu.org - United wholesale mortgages https://www.uwm.com/
- Watermark Home Loans https://www.watermarkho
meloans.com/ - West Coast Mortgage Associates (The loan broker is in So.Cal. Debbie Morgan) https://wcmtg.com/
Shahhere
Old Thread - https://slickdeals.net/e/1223863-03-06-2009-best-mortgage-rates-from-big-reputable-lenders-30year-5-15year-5-arm-s-etc
Community Wiki
Last Edited by RiversofWisdom
August 18, 2021
at
03:12 PM
This post can be edited by most users to provide up-to-date information about developments of this thread based on user responses, and user findings. Feel free to add, change or remove information shown here as it becomes available. This includes new coupons, rebates, ideas, thread summary, and similar items.
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Good site for daily mortgage news. Subscribe to their daily mortgage rate news to learn about their predictions. Also take a look at the rest of their site.
http://www.mortgagenew
Potential Lenders - Mentioned in Thread
*Please add to this list and add locality if applicable*
Discount lenders who DO NOT accept fully documented in tax returns self-employment income:
Owning.com
BoxHomeLoans
Lower.com
Discount Lenders that DO accept fully documented in tax returns self-employment income:
Sebonic
Caliber
Sage
Title Company Shopping
AltTitle.com
mytitlegenius.com (formerly entitle direct)
TO AVOID - Settlement LTD (local Pittsburgh run away from them - high cost, very bad service, lot of delays)
Feel Free to Add Sections for Each Lender - MeAPhool
Loan Cabin - DetailsWARNING. DO NOT GO WITH LOAN CABIN. TRUST ME.
I would have lost the home if i was trying to buy a house.
I just had a normal refi and it took then 127 days to close. out of the 27 emails i sent, they responded to 3. I even had to call (complain) their main office 2 times to get a response to any emails. they screwed the closing paperwork as well.
Loan Cabin does not charge lender fees. Actually all of this is in their FAQ but of course nobody reads anything and wants everything spoon fed.
This means A+B (reference the link above in the wiki regarding Loan Estimate) in the Loan Estimate should be 0 (as long as your appraisal is waived).
You will be responsible for Title Cost (of course you can shop that to your heart's delight)
You will be responsible for Recording Fee in your county
You will be responsible for Escrows (if you so choose OR if you are close to Homeowner's OR Property Tax payment - though you can negotiate and show evidence to get it waived. Most lender's will waive it if you are choosing not to escrow and you can show proof that you paid the upcoming Property Tax or Homeowner's Insurance)
You will be responsible for Prepaid Interest (this isn't a cost. If you didn't refinance, you'd be paying the interest at your current mortgage rate which I assume would be higher).
Lender Credit - If this covers A+B+C+E then you have a no-cost refinance. If you have a surplus aside from A+B+C+E, then technically you made money on your refinance.
If you apply and do no hear back for 3 days, then on the 3rd business day, reach out to [email protected]. They will usually help get a response on your application within a day.
If the information in this WIKI does not cover your questions, then please ask. We will answer and update WIKI accordingly.
Thanks - MeAPhool
Once a Thread Wiki is added to a thread, "Create Wiki" button will disappear. If you would like to learn more about Thread Wiki feature, click here.
|
Quote
from MeAPhool
I think a lot of people get confused with regards to "no closing cost". Specifically I think that is with regards to A+B+C (as referenced in this post by volcomssj48 - https://slickdeals.net/forums/showpost.php?p=
:
As per volcomssj48, this is a good place to go for a basic understanding of the LE (Loan Estimate) that should be provided to you by each lender once you give all of your information: https://www.consumerfin I'm in NJ so I can't really shop Title Insurance much as it's the cost is regulated by the state, however in other states, you can really cut down some of the costs in section "C". |
http://www.mortgagenew
Potential Lenders - Mentioned in Thread
*Please add to this list and add locality if applicable*
- Loan Cabin https://www.loancabin.c
om/ - Better.com https://better.com/
- Interactive Mortgage https://interactivemortgage.com/
- LenderFi https://www.lenderfi.co
m/ - owning.com (Operates only in CA) https://owning.com/
- NIH credit union (Delware, District of Columbia, Maryland, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Virginia, West Virginia) https://www.nihfcu.org/
- Loan Depot https://www.loandepot.c
om/ - Travis Credit Union (12 North Cal Counties only) https://www.traviscu.or
g/ Eligibility [traviscu.org] - Pentagon Federal CU https://www.penfed.org/
- Interactive Mortgage https://interactivemort
gage.com/ - NavyFederal CU https://www.navyfederal
.org/ - United wholesale mortgages https://www.uwm.com/
- BoxHomeLoans https://www.boxhomeloan
s.com/ - LoanLock https://www.loanlock.co
m/ - West Coast Mortgage Associates (The loan broker is in So.Cal. Debbie Morgan) https://wcmtg.com/
- RatePlus (California) https://www.rateplus.co
m/ - Northpointe Bank https://www.northpointe
.com/ - HighTechLending https://hightechlending
.mortgagewebcen ter.com/ - Close Your Own Loan https://www.closeyourow
nloan.com/...sults.aspx - AimLoan - will give LE without hard pull if credit is frozen https://www.aimloan.com/
- Amerisave - will give you scores from all 3 bureaus with just a soft pull
https://www.amerisave.com/ - Provident - will give LE without locking rate https://www.provident.c
om/ Best Credit Back with 60% LTV or better. - Watermark Home Loans https://www.watermarkho
meloans.com/ Skip these guys. They are being rude to Slickdealers. In one occasion they have explicitly said they don't want to do business with people from Slickdeals. They also have an approach where they give you the best rate initially and just raise it more each time you ask. - Colonial Mort http://www.colonialmor
t.com/ - Annie Mac https://www.annie-mac.com/ Licensed in these states https://www.annie-mac.com/page/licensed-states/
- Rate Rabbit https://www.raterabbit.
com/ Licensed in MA and others [raterabbit.com]
Discount lenders who DO NOT accept fully documented in tax returns self-employment income:
Owning.com
BoxHomeLoans
Lower.com
Discount Lenders that DO accept fully documented in tax returns self-employment income:
Sebonic
Caliber
Sage
Title Company Shopping
AltTitle.com
mytitlegenius.com (formerly entitle direct)
TO AVOID - Settlement LTD (local Pittsburgh run away from them - high cost, very bad service, lot of delays)
Feel Free to Add Sections for Each Lender - MeAPhool
Loan Cabin - DetailsWARNING. DO NOT GO WITH LOAN CABIN. TRUST ME.
I would have lost the home if i was trying to buy a house.
I just had a normal refi and it took then 127 days to close. out of the 27 emails i sent, they responded to 3. I even had to call (complain) their main office 2 times to get a response to any emails. they screwed the closing paperwork as well.
Loan Cabin does not charge lender fees. Actually all of this is in their FAQ but of course nobody reads anything and wants everything spoon fed.
This means A+B (reference the link above in the wiki regarding Loan Estimate) in the Loan Estimate should be 0 (as long as your appraisal is waived).
You will be responsible for Title Cost (of course you can shop that to your heart's delight)
You will be responsible for Recording Fee in your county
You will be responsible for Escrows (if you so choose OR if you are close to Homeowner's OR Property Tax payment - though you can negotiate and show evidence to get it waived. Most lender's will waive it if you are choosing not to escrow and you can show proof that you paid the upcoming Property Tax or Homeowner's Insurance)
You will be responsible for Prepaid Interest (this isn't a cost. If you didn't refinance, you'd be paying the interest at your current mortgage rate which I assume would be higher).
Lender Credit - If this covers A+B+C+E then you have a no-cost refinance. If you have a surplus aside from A+B+C+E, then technically you made money on your refinance.
If you apply and do no hear back for 3 days, then on the 3rd business day, reach out to [email protected]. They will usually help get a response on your application within a day.
If the information in this WIKI does not cover your questions, then please ask. We will answer and update WIKI accordingly.
Thanks - MeAPhool
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Quote
from arouncoumar
For those needing clarity on LC closing costs, I was on the same boat. See what they charge here https://www.dropbox.com/s/r30ecea...t.png
:
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Quote
from PeterLegend
Here is a photo of my loan estimate from Loan Cabin, my lender credits should be closer to 3K based on my initial conversations with Bob so i'm following up with him on that.
:
I do see title insurance in my estimate. I reached out to Owning but I didn't quality for the no cost refinance option since my LTV was 73%, it has to be 50% or lower when I spoke to them. |
5,912 Comments
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So...there we go.
Go here and in a sample calculation: $500,000 with $100,000 down at 3.15%
10 year payment $4603
15 year payment $3504 + $1099 extra monthly payment (diff between the 2)
The amortization will show you will pay the 15 in 10 year (maybe a partial month spill over due to rounding).
I'd even encourage people taking 15 over 30 to take a 30 and pay the extra like 15 and you'll pay it off in 16-18 years with flexibility to not pay extra if your financial situation changes. This only works if rate difference is not too large but if you take 2.5% vs 1.75% (30vs15) and pay the monthly diff you can pay it off in 1 extra year or 16 total years.
Shahhere
House is the safest easiest way for the average person to get massive leverage with low risk, why accelerate the timetable and put yourself in a riskier spot?
With the fed printing and the govt spending like a drunken sailor on shore leave, theres almost no chance youd do worse than 2.75% CAGR in the market or other inflation-resistant assets.
Net of it is though that as long as your discount rate assumptions are higher than your mortgage rate (which they always should be, as mortgages are STEALS vis a vis any other loan or form of leverage) youll end up with a better NPV on the longer term loan.
Step 1: Find a 30 year payment and a 15 year payment.
Step 2: Make a few assumptions about discount rate and run some numbers, I use 6% a year as a baseline but you can play with various assumptions.
Step 3: Crunch some numbers...
30 year formula =PV((DISCOUNT_RATE)/12, 360, (PAYMENT), 0, 0)
15 year formula =PV((DISCOUNT_RATE)/12, 180, (PAYMENT), 0, 0)
Example from google calculator quick math...
510k mortgage 30 yr 2.75 payment = 2080
510k mortgage 15 yr 2.50 payment = 3400
Your 30 yr will cost you 347k in 2020 dollars.
Your 15 yr will cost you 403k in 2020 dollars.
You can poke holes in this a bit as its not technically what the formula was designed to do, but it can proxy as a nice way to realize that with inflation and historical stock market returns that cheap safe leverage is usually to your advantage. To me its a no brainer to invest the extra 1300 bucks a month for 15 years in the stock market, and use those returns to continue paying the mortgage with 2035-2050 toilet paper future dollars. Not to mention that even if you ignore time value of money completely, that taking a 2.75 30 year vs a 2.5 15 year is basically buying unemployment insurance for 0.25% a year, as you are significantly less likely to default and lose your house with a 1300/mo cheaper payment. If you hate money and would rather pay off a sub 3% loan than invest that money in the stock market, feel free, but at least give yourself the luxury of lower payments.
So...there we go.
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Net of it is though that as long as your discount rate assumptions are higher than your mortgage rate (which they always should be, as mortgages are STEALS vis a vis any other loan or form of leverage) youll end up with a better NPV on the longer term loan.
Step 1: Find a 30 year payment and a 15 year payment.
Step 2: Make a few assumptions about discount rate and run some numbers, I use 6% a year as a baseline but you can play with various assumptions.
Step 3: Crunch some numbers...
30 year formula =PV((DISCOUNT_RATE)/12, 360, (PAYMENT), 0, 0)
15 year formula =PV((DISCOUNT_RATE)/12, 180, (PAYMENT), 0, 0)
Example from google calculator quick math...
510k mortgage 30 yr 2.75 payment = 2080
510k mortgage 15 yr 2.50 payment = 3400
Your 30 yr will cost you 347k in 2020 dollars.
Your 15 yr will cost you 403k in 2020 dollars.
You can poke holes in this a bit as its not technically what the formula was designed to do, but it can proxy as a nice way to realize that with inflation and historical stock market returns that cheap safe leverage is usually to your advantage. To me its a no brainer to invest the extra 1300 bucks a month for 15 years in the stock market, and use those returns to continue paying the mortgage with 2035-2050 toilet paper future dollars. Not to mention that even if you ignore time value of money completely, that taking a 2.75 30 year vs a 2.5 15 year is basically buying unemployment insurance for 0.25% a year, as you are significantly less likely to default and lose your house with a 1300/mo cheaper payment. If you hate money and would rather pay off a sub 3% loan than invest that money in the stock market, feel free, but at least give yourself the luxury of lower payments.
Here is a scenario to layer on top of your example. Does this argument hold true for someone who is not planning to keep the same house say not more than 10 years. Is it still better to consider 30 instead of 15? If it matters, currently on a 30 years loan @ 4.125% with 27 years remaining. So I know I'm going to refinance for sure. Just trying to figure out 30 years vs 15 years.
The way the little press release is written, it sounds like consumers could get the rate. I noted earlier that it sounded too good to be true. But I checked anyway because why not.
On day 1 of a loan, you owe 3% (for example) of the balance. Since the balance is high, interest is a higher part of the payment. There is no EXTRA interest just because they want to get interest. It is math.
If you get a 30 year loan, but make payments as if it was a 15 year loan, you get the same interest payments as if it was a 15 year loan. You are knocking down the principle so, the monthly interest is then lower.
You could have added that since your monthly P+I is fixed, the interest charged is deducted of that and whatever is remaining is applied to your principal.
Here is a scenario to layer on top of your example. Does this argument hold true for someone who is not planning to keep the same house say not more than 10 years. Is it still better to consider 30 instead of 15? If it matters, currently on a 30 years loan @ 4.125% with 27 years remaining. So I know I'm going to refinance for sure. Just trying to figure out 30 years vs 15 years.
I value my opportunity cost at about 6% APR because Im young and can handle the risk and swings of the market. If you are extremely risk averse or have risk associated with employment or would upset your kids lives if you had to sell the house it might make sense to take your guaranteed 3% return to pay off mortgage early. But even in that scenario, the small savings on a 15 yr vs a 30 would never be worth it to me to give up that much financial flexibility with significantly higher mandatory payments.
I look at things from an NPV/opportunity cost perspective and have financial flexibility and plenty of cashflow to be able to pivot. Some people are more comfortable with Dave Ramsey type advice and want to be very defined and locked into their monthly budget.
You could have added that since your monthly P+I is fixed, the interest charged is deducted of that and whatever is remaining is applied to your principal.
I might add (sorry - I always have to add something)...
The interest owed each month is based on the current balance. As the balance drops, the amount of monthly interest drops. Everything above the interest payment is applied to principle.
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